Magic Wants a Star, I Say Be Careful and Patient (P. 3)

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kkennon1
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Tempy wrote:
Super talent with Kyle Korver, Jr Smith, Battier, and Miller in the same sentence? Are you actually serious? They are specialists that fill a role. The Cavs have 2 superstar players in LBJ and Irving. Love is an all star, the rest of the roster is good at best.

Unless you want to tell me you would be happy that the Lakers signed any of the following this summer: Frye, Jefferson, Dahnty Jones, Korver, JR Smith, Shumpert, Tristan Thompson, Deron or Derrick Williams. If you did I would say your full of bullsh.........

Thank you, nicely put !!!!

BaadMaster
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Tempy wrote:
Super talent with Kyle Korver, Jr Smith, Battier, and Miller in the same sentence? Are you actually serious? They are specialists that fill a role. The Cavs have 2 superstar players in LBJ and Irving. Love is an all star, the rest of the roster is good at best. ..

In the new three point obsessed NBA, players like Korver, Smith et. al. are much more valuable than they were, say, five years ago. Props to LBJ for conniving to get three point players.

There is no doubt that to get to all these Finals (albeit in a week East) that the man is great. But he also uses that greatness in a way no one else had figured on -- using salesmanship, salary cuts and savvy trades (in partnership with his GM) to adjust to this new reality.

I do predict that the Cavs will beat the Dubs -- once again with a bit of luck. First Green getting suspended and now replacing their coach with Mike "You're not a wartime consigliere" Brown.

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
Kobe best of what 4???? Hope your not including MJ. Because that would be laughable.

Well considering I was replying to your post and the 4 players you named, I'll let you go back and read it.

JJCali
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BaadMaster wrote:
LBJ is clearly the best conniving GM of all time. He is able to surround himself with super-talent 1-9 -- no wonder he gets to the Finals year after year. Do it the "old fashioned way" -- like Duncan, Kobe, MJ, etc -- and see if he gets to the Finals as often as he does. Yes he is a great player -- but an even better GM!

The list of his "aquisitions" is staggering -- DWade, Bosh, Love, Irving, Korver, JR Smith, Battier, Allen, Miller. 'Nuff said.

Perfectly put. Lebron lovers want to ignore this or get mad at you for pointing it out. It's not like we're making it up, or it's even an opinion. They really did get all these players...

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
Duncan had great talent around him, MJ too! Although MJ made more of a personal impact in finals than others have. Kobe/Shaq Lakers were loaded.

But agree Baad, LBJ is one hell of a GM. Probably because he's more Magic than MJ or Kobe, makes players better around him, so players want to play with him.

You're one of my favorite posters on here, but this loses you points right here. The Bulls were loaded?? Jordan had Pippen. That's it for the first 3. And they added Rodman who was the best rebounder and annoyed the hell out of people on defense but was an atrocious offensive player. Kobe and Shaq had each other! Then they had role players. Then on his last 2 Kobe had Pau, who isn't even on the same level as the others listed, but then no other all-stars. There's nothing wrong with us pointing out who James has had to have on his team. You don't have to get upset, it's not like because we point out Kobe has 2 more rings without the same level of talent means we are somehow completely discrediting your beloved LBJ. Chill!

kkennon1
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JJCali wrote:
You're one of my favorite posters on here, but this loses you points right here. The Bulls were loaded?? Jordan had Pippen. That's it for the first 3. And they added Rodman who was the best rebounder and annoyed the hell out of people on defense but was an atrocious offensive player. Kobe and Shaq had each other! Then they had role players. Then on his last 2 Kobe had Pau, who isn't even on the same level as the others listed, but then no other all-stars. There's nothing wrong with us pointing out who James has had to have on his team. You don't have to get upset, it's not like because we point out Kobe has 2 more rings without the same level of talent means we are somehow completely discrediting your beloved LBJ. Chill!

1st place, LBJ isn't even one of my top 5 favorite players. But I respect his game, like I respected Bird, Hakeem, Duncan and others. Funny how you change things to put your almighty Kobe on top no matter what, but I remember not to long ago, you saying yourself MJ was best player you've seen.

One thing to point out JJ that LBJ will always have over Kobe. you said Kobe would have won as many or more chips if he was on Cavs or Heat, well hard to say that , because players wouldn't have went either place to play with Kobe !!!!

As far as MJ goes, I'm not basing my opinion on chips or teammates. He's just the best I've ever seen play period! Imo

Good to have you back JJ, I missed our debates. Lol

Tempy
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BaadMaster wrote:
In the new three point obsessed NBA, players like Korver, Smith et. al. are much more valuable than they were, say, five years ago. Props to LBJ for conniving to get three point players.

There is no doubt that to get to all these Finals (albeit in a week East) that the man is great. But he also uses that greatness in a way no one else had figured on -- using salesmanship, salary cuts and savvy trades (in partnership with his GM) to adjust to this new reality.

I do predict that the Cavs will beat the Dubs -- once again with a bit of luck. First Green getting suspended and now replacing their coach with Mike "You're not a wartime consigliere" Brown.

Who exactly is getting salary cuts on the Cavs roster? Thompson is getting $16m, JR Smith $13m, Shumpert $10m, Frye $8m. They are all overpaid lol.

What people fail to take into account is LBJ KNOWS he can't win on his own, and that he needs help. Kobe would never accept that. Both are admirable in different ways. LBJ doesn't win rings without help, Kobe would have won more with help.

userpete1037
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Ain't none of them better than my (God) Magic!!!....Now take that KK and JJ....lmao!!!!!

BaadMaster
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I can state this without fear of contradiction: The Kobe/Pau teams were likely the worst in terms of All-Star talent to repeat! Kobe had a flawed team with one bonafide Superstar (Kobe, duh!), Mitch (give him credit) added Pau and VOILA! -- three Finals in a row. At that point, Kobe was THAT good on both sides of the ball.

On a depressing note, Pau is still chasing another title with the Spurs. That we got nothing for him is one of the reasons I am writing this rather than watching the Lakers in the playoffs!

kkennon1
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userpete1037 wrote:
Ain't none of them better than my (God) Magic!!!....Now take that KK and JJ....lmao!!!!!

Lol, like I said, everyone has their own favorites.

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
1st place, LBJ isn't even one of my top 5 favorite players. But I respect his game, like I respected Bird, Hakeem, Duncan and others. Funny how you change things to put your almighty Kobe on top no matter what, but I remember not to long ago, you saying yourself MJ was best player you've seen.

One thing to point out JJ that LBJ will always have over Kobe. you said Kobe would have won as many or more chips if he was on Cavs or Heat, well hard to say that , because players wouldn't have went either place to play with Kobe !!!!

As far as MJ goes, I'm not basing my opinion on chips or teammates. He's just the best I've ever seen play period! Imo

Good to have you back JJ, I missed our debates. Lol

Jordan is the best player I've ever seen. I've never put Kobe ahead of him.

I too base this off how good they were. Stats and chips are more like tie breakers in a debate. But at the end of the day, a better player is a better player. That's why even if he wins 3 more I wouldn't put LBJ over Kobe. Unless somehow he becomes a better player while doing it. Which won't happen. We've obviously seen his peak. Anyways, like you, the best player that I've ever watched is definitely Jordan. And for me, Kobe is definitely the 2nd best I've ever seen. No one is close to them. Yeah, I didn't watch Wilt, so to some degree you gotta go by the historians of the game and how much those guys won...

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
1st place, LBJ isn't even one of my top 5 favorite players. But I respect his game, like I respected Bird, Hakeem, Duncan and others. Funny how you change things to put your almighty Kobe on top no matter what, but I remember not to long ago, you saying yourself MJ was best player you've seen.

One thing to point out JJ that LBJ will always have over Kobe. you said Kobe would have won as many or more chips if he was on Cavs or Heat, well hard to say that , because players wouldn't have went either place to play with Kobe !!!!

As far as MJ goes, I'm not basing my opinion on chips or teammates. He's just the best I've ever seen play period! Imo

Good to have you back JJ, I missed our debates. Lol

Thanks, Bro! Haha

JJCali
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BaadMaster wrote:
I can state this without fear of contradiction: The Kobe/Pau teams were likely the worst in terms of All-Star talent to repeat! Kobe had a flawed team with one bonafide Superstar (Kobe, duh!), Mitch (give him credit) added Pau and VOILA! -- three Finals in a row. At that point, Kobe was THAT good on both sides of the ball.

On a depressing note, Pau is still chasing another title with the Spurs. That we got nothing for him is one of the reasons I am writing this rather than watching the Lakers in the playoffs!

I completely agree. We had Fisher (clutch but that's about it) Odom, Vujacic(!) Farmar, a young Ariza, a young Bynum, who was usually hurt anyways... that talent level compared to the top two teams now is a joke!

userpete1037
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kkennon1 wrote:
Lol, like I said, everyone has their own favorites.

LMAO!!!!....I had to get in there. You and JJ going hard in the pint....lol.

Tempy
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JJCali wrote:
I completely agree. We had Fisher (clutch but that's about it) Odom, Vujacic(!) Farmar, a young Ariza, a young Bynum, who was usually hurt anyways... that talent level compared to the top two teams now is a joke!

Odom was 6th man of the year, Bynum was 2nd best center in the league at that time, some will argue he was better than D12. People act like it was a team of Scrubs trying to build up Kobe. They also forget that the team was coached by arguably the greatest coach of all time. Take the darn Rose tinted glasses off.

BaadMaster
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Tempy wrote:
Super talent with Kyle Korver, Jr Smith, Battier, and Miller in the same sentence? Are you actually serious? They are specialists that fill a role. The Cavs have 2 superstar players in LBJ and Irving. Love is an all star, the rest of the roster is good at best.....

Compare that roster with the "Mediocres" that Kobe had during the Pau run. It was basically "Kobe and Pau and not very wow!"

I stand by my observation that the Kobe/Pau roster sucked compared to any LBJ group. And this group got to the Finals three times, repeating once. 'Nuff said.

kkennon1
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Tempy
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BaadMaster wrote:
Compare that roster with the "Mediocres" that Kobe had during the Pau run. It was basically "Kobe and Pau and not very wow!"

I stand by my observation that the Kobe/Pau roster sucked compared to any LBJ group. And this group got to the Finals three times, repeating once. 'Nuff said.

Ok I think we need to define mediocre here because Odom was a 6th man of the year, Bynum was posting 15 and 8 and MWP at 30 was actually still offering solid production. Fish and S. Brown were definitely average at worst. Farmar was a typical back up point. Coached by the best coach ever. Wtf is mediocre about the above?

kkennon1
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Tempy wrote:
Ok I think we need to define mediocre here because Odom was a 6th man of the year, Bynum was posting 15 and 8 and MWP at 30 was actually still offering solid production. Fish and S. Brown were definitely average at worst. Farmar was a typical back up point. Coached by the best coach ever. Wtf is mediocre about the above?

Tempy you can argue all day, it's LBJ!!! It won't make a difference. For me it doesn't come down to roster, it's more about who could get best out of roster. LBJ could have done same thing with Lakers roster, but I question if Kobe would have played team ball enough to win in Miami or Cleveland???

Tempy
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kkennon1 wrote:
Tempy you can argue all day, it's LBJ!!! It won't make a difference. For me it doesn't come down to roster, it's more about who could get best out of roster. LBJ could have done same thing with Lakers roster, but I question if Kobe would have played team ball enough to win in Miami or Cleveland???

Yeah I know. There are no NBA championship teams that were mediocre, I've yet to see a team come out of the west that were in the past 15+ years.

It is impossible to objectively compare player a versus player b, there are just so many different variables that are not factored, and can not be factored or measured.

I should know better than bring rational reasoning to a Laker forum. Lol

userpete1037
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kkennon1 wrote:

There is cold hard truth in those post.....smh......Dam the truth hurts....lol.

gonzo08452
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userpete1037 wrote:
There is cold hard truth in those post.....smh......Dam the truth hurts....lol.

True but I'm not convinced the young 'core' will be as good as advertised. Hope I'm wrong.

IhatetheCeltics
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kkennon1 wrote:

I really don't believe they will move George this summer. They'll do everything they can to put a winning team around him, and if they can't, then they'll move him at the deadline. They'll get less return at the deadline, but think they'll at least give it a shot.

FrankBecerra
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I think when magic says he wants a star, he's talking about a star on the Hollywood walk of fame and most folks think that he is talking about the Lakes

lakerdudeinindy
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IhatetheCeltics wrote:
I really don't believe they will move George this summer. They'll do everything they can to put a winning team around him, and if they can't, then they'll move him at the deadline. They'll get less return at the deadline, but think they'll at least give it a shot.

I have to agree. Unless, a deal knocks the Pacers completely over, Pritchard will try to surround George with better talent and then see at the deadline if they need to start over. In a way that benefits us also. We can at least see if our lottery pick works well with the team, if Randle, Russell has improved .If they have, then possibly George may want to come here. Supposedly, if he IS hell bent on coming here, then presenting him with a younger and competitive team works without having to gut the team and possibly walk, because the roster resembles the roster he is trying to leave.

kkennon1
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lakerdudeinindy wrote:
I have to agree. Unless, a deal knocks the Pacers completely over, Pritchard will try to surround George with better talent and then see at the deadline if they need to start over. In a way that benefits us also. We can at least see if our lottery pick works well with the team, if Randle, Russell has improved .If they have, then possibly George may want to come here. Supposedly, if he IS hell bent on coming here, then presenting him with a younger and competitive team works without having to gut the team and possibly walk, because the roster resembles the roster he is trying to leave.

Totally agree, think people forget, PG said when all this 1st started that he preferred to make it work in Indiana. But have to say I find it interesting that he hasn't came out and said that rumors aren't true, like other players have that have been linked to Lakers thru media.

lakerdudeinindy
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kkennon1 wrote:
Totally agree, think people forget, PG said when all this 1st started that he preferred to make it work in Indiana. But have to say I find it interesting that he hasn't came out and said that rumors aren't true, like other players have that have been linked to Lakers through media.

I think the rumors are true, but I think PG wants to make it work somewhat, but I think if Indy is going to continue to tread water, then I think he will push being traded by the deadline or just outright leave. I think PG doesn't want a lot of attention drawn to him with this, but well it's not working and with him not addressing the rumors it makes it look more and more that he wants to leave.

userpete1037
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Man ain't nothing go work in Indy or the east as long as LBJ is on that side of town.....period.

JJCali
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userpete1037 wrote:
Man ain't nothing go work in Indy or the east as long as LBJ is on that side of town.....period.

You mean not while he's got a super team. You trade George and LBJ, I promise you LBJ ain't making the finals on that Indy team.

userpete1037
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JJCali wrote:
You mean not while he's got a super team. You trade George and LBJ, I promise you LBJ ain't making the finals on that Indy team.

Stop it JJ....lol...LBJ could get on Brooklyn and take them to the finals.

kkennon1
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userpete1037 wrote:
Stop it JJ....lol...LBJ could get on Brooklyn and take them to the finals.

Lol, don't know about Nets, but he could get every team that made East playoffs into championship, plus Miami if current teams is healthy.

JJCali
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userpete1037 wrote:
Stop it JJ....lol...LBJ could get on Brooklyn and take them to the finals.

That's 0% true and you know it!

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
Lol, don't know about Nets, but he could get every team that made East playoffs into championship, plus Miami if current teams is healthy.

You've lost your mind if you think Indy would have made the finals with LBJ but no George. They wouldn't even make the conference finals.

kkennon1
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JJCali wrote:
You've lost your mind if you think Indy would have made the finals with LBJ but no George. They wouldn't even make the conference finals.

Didn't say anything about no George, I said he makes every team in East a championship contender, except for Nets.

Thinking about it, Indy would make finals with no PG, because every other player would have went there to play with LBJ. Lol

kkennon1
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Nice plan, doubt FO will be this patient.

SPQR
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FrankBecerra wrote:
I think when magic says he wants a star, he's talking about a star on the Hollywood walk of fame and most folks think that he is talking about the Lakes

LOL. Very good Frank. And I'm sure there is truth there too!

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
Didn't say anything about no George, I said he makes every team in East a championship contender, except for Nets.

Thinking about it, Indy would make finals with no PG, because every other player would have went there to play with LBJ. Lol

I said if you traded George for LBJ. Didn't realize you were changing the narrative.

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
Nice plan, doubt FO will be this patient.

I mostly like this plan too. With Ball and Ingram I'd probably start Clarkson than Russell, but I agree with this approach. That team would be amazing in a few years.

kkennon1
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JJCali wrote:
I said if you traded George for LBJ. Didn't realize you were changing the narrative.

Oh ok, but you can't really say he wouldn't get team in championship, because players would follow him to Indy. But no, if you traded just them with same team around them , he probably wouldn't get to championship. But neither would PG on Cavs .

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
Oh ok, but you can't really say he wouldn't get team in championship, because players would follow him to Indy. But no, if you traded just them with same team around them , he probably wouldn't get to championship. But neither would PG on Cavs .

In the east... that's definitely debatable. The Cavs would still be the most talented team in the east by a lot. Plus George and Indy almost beat LBJ and Miami with a way more stacked team. It's more likely that Cleveland would get to the finals with George than Indy with LBJ anyways.

kkennon1
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JJCali wrote:
In the east... that's definitely debatable. The Cavs would still be the most talented team in the east by a lot. Plus George and Indy almost beat LBJ and Miami with a way more stacked team. It's more likely that Cleveland would get to the finals with George than Indy with LBJ anyways.

Don't get the whole stacked thing, Miami fell off almost 20 games after LBJ left and missed playoffs, with almost the same roster.

But agree ,it is more likely.

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:
Don't get the whole stacked thing, Miami fell off almost 20 games after LBJ left and missed playoffs, with almost the same roster.

But agree ,it is more likely.

Stacked as in George was the best player for Indy. He was just becoming a star. At that time, he would have possibly been the 4th best player on Miami.

kkennon1
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Looks like Dlo has been hitting the weights. Upper body looks bigger.

JJCali
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HIs shot almost looks identical to Ball's haha.

userpete1037
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JJCali wrote:
HIs shot almost looks identical to Ball's haha.

It sure does....lol. How ironic.

kkennon1
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Randle getting rid of that extra body fat. LOL

FrankBecerra
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Mitch was saying that he likes the extra work that Julius is puttin in this summer!

JJCali
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kkennon1 wrote:

Randle getting rid of that extra body fat. LOL

This is the third year in a row I've heard about what great shape he's getting in... Either it's been BS or he's just going to be a complete freak athlete be next year.

kkennon1
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JJCali wrote:
This is the third year in a row I've heard about what great shape he's getting in... Either it's been BS or he's just going to be a complete freak athlete be next year.

Last season he looked stronger, but still chubby. Looks more lean.

lake24show
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FrankBecerra wrote:
Mitch was saying that he likes the extra work that Julius is puttin in this summer!

Who?!?!?!


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