The Official Lakers Trade Ideas Thread (P. 257)

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Tempy
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Ray wrote:
Maybe does taking Kuz out of the starting lineup and placing Randle in there make that a better starting lineup? I could be wrong but aren't you about having shooters around LeBron? We can argue this back and fourth forever, he is having an Allstar year if he was in the East right now. So that assumes he should get a payday next year then right? I guess we will see what's happens next year when he can opt out and hit FA again.
Why Kuzma and not Ingram? Or Randle over McGee depending on match ups. It gives....

Shepherd
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There simply must have been more going on than we know about on the Randle front. While I was not his biggest fan, I was surprised when they let him go so cheap. And that no one else stepped up to nab him. Projections at the time (among us anyways) were that after the year he has his last season on the Lakers, he'd be wanting a $20M/yr deal. Tho many tempered that by saying most likely he'd realistically get $12-15M. Instead he got a short team deal for $9M. And he's on a team in the shadow of a superstar, so isn't probably garnering very much attention. Again there must be reasons for all that we're not aware of. Maybe his gf doesn't like LA. Maybe the team disrespected him, or he thought they did. Or maybe he's a pain in the azz. Who knows. I expected him to go to another team and that we wouldn't match any offers over $12+M. But for $9M we'd be hard pressed to find another equivalent player. Until someone comes out and says something that clears it up. It's a bit of a mystery. KCP is making $12M, Rondo $9M. I remember there was a sort of cut off point where going over could affect our cap space. And obviously Cap space was paramount, and still is.

We're at $106M now for the team. But that's including Deng. KCP is on a 1 year deal. That's trade-able as an expiring. So are Rondo and Stevenson et al. Next year team payroll so far is $67.4M. If no one else is out there, do we try to wrestle Randle back? Next season's cap is $109M the next season's is $118M. So next season so far we have $42M to spend. Not saying there may not be better options than Randle. But for those who are nostalgic, it's a possibility. And perhaps for the money.

Ray
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Tempy wrote:
Why Kuzma and not Ingram? Or Randle over McGee depending on match ups. It gives the Lakers options that they don't have right now. Yes the Lakers need shooters but they also need someone they can rely on each night instead of having LBJ carry the load every single game.

It was also have given the Lakers a nice trade asset should something come up later in the season.

I said Kuzna because that’s realistically the guy he would replace.

BI is our starting SG, if BI goes to the bench, who plays SG, Kuz, Randle, or leBron?

There is no successful team that plays small ball on a nightly bases for their starting lineup. Not even the almighty Warriors have yet to attempt Green at center consistently and play center majority of his minutes. Warrior the ultimate small ball team, has always made sure they had an actual center and Green played forward most of the game.

So Randle for Kuz really would be the only option. An to tell you the truth, that’s probably what our FO thought as well and that was the fall out between us and Randle.

Maybe, we truly don’t know what we offered him if anything or what he was asking from us. He could of easily asked us for 80mil/4yr. But accepted a short term deal since FA was already dieing

So we really don’t know what his trade chip would look like since nobody has any clue what was asked for or offered or not offered.

Shepherd
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Becomes less of an issue if we trade BI and Ball tho Wink. Bring in a proper PG and small ball 4. Ahem. I never considered Randle to be a good under the basket rebounder. His arms are short and hands aren't big. But maybe that's just my impression. Can rotate Randle/Kuzma (he of the 32 pt game last night btw) and LBJ.

MAGICLAKEZ
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Ray wrote:
Randle doesn't have to be a #2 option, but with the fight "MAGICLAKEZ" is putting up for Randle it seemed like "MAGICLAKEZ" would consider Randle at least an #2 option.

I am not doubting his ability and how well he is playing. I am simply saying NBA Teams don't view his skill set to be that valuable. If they did, then a lot more teams would have been jumping to get him for only 9 million. Any team in the league could move a player and make 9 million in cap room. On top of that he took 9 million for Pelicans to come off the bench, so he didn't even make a starting lineup to start the year. He still wasn't starting until like 5 games ago when Mirotic was sick, how ever it does appear maybe Randle has won the starting gig.

I want to be clear, this is not me saying Randle sucks. I'm just showing what the league in general thinks about his skill set.

Go look backat my post, I thinking the Lakers would give him like 15 million and was all for it. At the end of the day, Randle didn't like whatever our FO told him and *HE was the one who asked to be released.

I don’t understand how you are stuck on the #2 option song and dance routine. I never said he would be the second option, you are putting words into my mouth. I just want him on the team. Period. You are stuck on this #2 option punchline since you are desperately looking to add another superstar to the roster. Hahaha.

Kuzma is great scorer and I love the way he’s been expanding his game by looking to make plays for others and putting more effort on the defensive end of the floor. However none of the guys on the roster is a natural PF. We have a plethora of wings/SF but no PF.

At least the Pelicans offered him a multi yr deal for $18, our fake azz cheapskates couldn’t offer him more than 1 year after jerking him around and giving him false hopes. At the late stage when they offered that 1 year “hand out” deal to him, most of the teams had already closed shop. That’s bad business and man management. Don’t do ISH like that if you want to attract future FA’s.

Ray
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
I don’t understand how you are stuck on the #2 option song and dance routine. I never said he would be the second option, you are putting words into my mouth. I just want him on the team. Period. You are stuck on this #2 option punchline since you are desperately looking to add another superstar to the roster. Hahaha.

Kuzma is great scorer and I love the way he’s been expanding his game by looking to make plays for others and putting more effort on the defensive end of the floor. However none of the guys on the roster is a natural PF. We have a plethora of wings/SF but no PF.

At least the Pelicans offered him a multi yr deal for $18, our fake azz cheapskates couldn’t offer him more than 1 year after jerking him around and giving him false hopes. At the late stage when they offered that 1 year “hand out” deal to him, most of the teams had already closed shop. That’s bad business and man management. Don’t do ISH like that if you want to attract future FA’s.

I clearly mentioned why I said #2 option, I just thought you were that high on him, evidently you are not as high on him as i thought. I have never seen so much debate on a guy that wasn't at least viewed as a #2 option for a team. You and Tempy both called me out on assuming he was valued as a potential #2 option for a team and you rightfully called me out. I did just assume so. I apologize for that.

I would disagree and say in today's NBA we do have guys that play natural PF spot with no issues.

Answer this question, which starting 5 do you think is better. LeBron was already coming here before we made decision on Randle.

What starting 5 is the best to have for 30+ minutes every game.

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Kuz, Javale

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Kuz, Randle

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Randle, Javale

To me it is the lineup without Randle since we have LeBron, that's really the only reason. To me Randle is not a good fit to play in a lineup that features LeBron and a Center that can't shoot. And I don't think it would be good to play Randle at Center for 30 minutes a game.

Tempy
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Ray wrote:
I clearly mentioned why I said #2 option, I just thought you were that high on him, evidently you are not as high on him as i thought. I have never seen so much debate on a guy that wasn't at least viewed as a #2 option for a team. You and Tempy both called me out on assuming he was valued as a potential #2 option for a team and you rightfully called me out. I did just assume so. I apologize for that.

I would disagree and say in today's NBA we do have guys that play natural PF spot with no issues.

Answer this question, which starting 5 do you think is better. LeBron was already coming here before we made decision on Randle.

What starting 5 is the best to have for 30+ minutes every game.

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Kuz, Javale

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Kuz, Randle

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Randle, Javale

To me it is the lineup without Randle since we have LeBron, that's really the only reason. To me Randle is not a good fit to play in a lineup that features LeBron and a Center that can't shoot. And I don't think it would be good to play Randle at Center for 30 minutes a game.

No one is saying he needs to play 30mins a game at center. With LBJ as point forward positions go out of the window on offense. Yes we could slide Kuz to "SG" because he would space the floor. Running pick and Rolls with LBJ and Randle would be a nightmare for any team to match up with. Ball could run the second unit and LBJ could play the traditional point guard position. Again it would give the Lakers options. Right now the options are Ball or Rondo. Basically same player. Hart or KCP. Basically the same player. JaVale or Chandler. Basically the same player.

Why does Ingram have to be in the starting line up? Kuz is completely outshining Ingram and Ball. Ingram and Ball both need the ball to be effective, one of them needs to run with the second unit to be effective.

Anyways, as you said earlier he is gone. So all we can do is hold the fo accountable for their actions going forward.

Ray
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Tempy wrote:
No one is saying he needs to play 30mins a game at center. With LBJ as point forward positions go out of the window on offense. Yes we could slide Kuz to "SG" because he would space the floor. Running pick and Rolls with LBJ and Randle would be a nightmare for any team to match up with. Ball could run the second unit and LBJ could play the traditional point guard position. Again it would give the Lakers options. Right now the options are Ball or Rondo. Basically same player. Hart or KCP. Basically the same player. JaVale or Chandler. Basically the same player.

Why does Ingram have to be in the starting line up? Kuz is completely outshining Ingram and Ball. Ingram and Ball both need the ball to be effective, one of them needs to run with the second unit to be effective.

Anyways, as you said earlier he is gone. So all we can do is hold the fo accountable for their actions going forward.

I agree, there are to many other factors that would come into play to truly say Randle on our team, instead of Rondo or KCP to say which group of guys would better. Truthfully, I am sure LeBron would figure out the best way to make it work. I was okay with Randle staying with us, but I was not upset with him leaving either. It would of been another hard decision followed with guys on our team getting butt-hurt because of mins.

The truth of his value will be told next summer, he is shinning brighter then ever right now and being noticed. Will he get a big deal next year? I am going on record and saying he gets deal like JC got next summer.

MAGICLAKEZ
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Ray wrote:
I clearly mentioned why I said #2 option, I just thought you were that high on him, evidently you are not as high on him as i thought. I have never seen so much debate on a guy that wasn't at least viewed as a #2 option for a team. You and Tempy both called me out on assuming he was valued as a potential #2 option for a team and you rightfully called me out. I did just assume so. I apologize for that.

I would disagree and say in today's NBA we do have guys that play natural PF spot with no issues.

Answer this question, which starting 5 do you think is better. LeBron was already coming here before we made decision on Randle.

What starting 5 is the best to have for 30+ minutes every game.

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Kuz, Javale

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Kuz, Randle

Lonzo, Ingram, LeBron, Randle, Javale

To me it is the lineup without Randle since we have LeBron, that's really the only reason. To me Randle is not a good fit to play in a lineup that features LeBron and a Center that can't shoot. And I don't think it would be good to play Randle at Center for 30 minutes a game.

Like Tempy also alluded to, we have too many replicas. I understand we acquired some cast off’s for grittiness and toughness but it doesn’t get any better than Randle if you are talking about toughness in the middle. Randle and Lebron would garner a lot of attention/double teams. You cannot leave them open since they can manufacture points and make plays for others if they get double teamed. Gives you a double threat in the paint. Randle can also guard and switch multiple positions. BI looks like he’s taken a step back this year. Lonzo is great one day and pathetic the other. They both need time on the bench. BI has already made it clear he doesn’t want the bench role. We crushed Randle when he pouted. Lol.

If you add Lebron to the roster you need consistency in performance/production. With Randle you know you are getting an automatic double double machine on a daily basis. With Kuz, Randle and Lebron in the starting unit, you have three potent weapons on the floor. In fact Randle was playing really well with Lonzo last season. They formed some great chemistry in a very short span of time. I really love McGee but I feel he’s not capable of banging with the bigs and is out of place most of the times. His rebounding leaves a lot to be desired. The ideal scenario would have been to have Randle at the five and Chandler as the back up. McGee is really a luxury at this point.

Addendum: One last thing I would like to mention. If we let Randle walk and acquired an impact player or superstar I would probably reconcile with the decision. However you signed KCP for $12m to sit on the bench. You dumped an impact player to sign multiple bench players/cast off’s. That makes it tough to swallow. And then you let him walk for nothing. Smh.

kkennon1
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Well Hell !!

TimmyDoe
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kkennon1 wrote:
Well Hell !!

According to O’Connor himself he said the way he worded it was inaccurate. There’s still a lot that can happen and things can change.

I remember when Michael beasley (when he was good) was a lock to be a Laker but come trade deadline trade fell through.

Shepherd
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Typical Lakers. Always going backwards lol. Not saying he can't help the team. But it's just odd how infrequently they turn to new players, vs adding ones who've played here before. Other than the odd 1 year filler. Which is why it won't surprise me if they try and get Randle back. They do the same thing with coaches often times. Just a Laker thing. They don't trust the unknown I guess.

Angeluus
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Shepherd wrote:
Typical Lakers. Always going backwards lol. Not saying he can't help the team. But it's just odd how infrequently they turn to new players, vs adding ones who've played here before. Other than the odd 1 year filler. Which is why it won't surprise me if they try and get Randle back. They do the same thing with coaches often times. Just a Laker thing. They don't trust the unknown I guess.

Remember when they brought back Vlade Divac? Disaster....

MAGICLAKEZ
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Ariza is not active today in the Phx game. Lol.

Shepherd
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Angeluus wrote:
Remember when they brought back Vlade Divac? Disaster....

Most, if not all, of the 2nd timers are disasters.

suntzu619
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
Ariza is not active today in the Phx game. Lol.

I saw that also. I'm beginning to think that Ariza is going to be back in purple and gold after this Saturday.

Ray
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I think he is coming here only because I haven't really heard much of other teams trying to get him. I have heard rumors of other teams needing/wanting him. But not any that are currently working to get a deal done besides the Lakers. I think him coming to the Lakers would give him a purpose again like Tyson and I would welcome it, if it's only costing us KCP.

Tempy
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Ray wrote:
I think he is coming here only because I haven't really heard much of other teams trying to get him. I have heard rumors of other teams needing/wanting him. But not any that are currently working to get a deal done besides the Lakers. I think him coming to the Lakers would give him a purpose again like Tyson and I would welcome it, if it's only costing us KCP.

I don't see why the Sun's take KCP straight up. They already did the Lakers a favor with the Chandler deal, I get the feeling this will be the Lakers turn to scratch their back. They are going to give up a 2nd rounder at a minimum.

Interestingly the trade machines out there say this trade does nothing regarding projected wins for either team lol.

For anyone Wondering if it's possible to straight up trade KCP to Ariza. It is. The 50% trade rule is invoked in this situation.

Ray
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Tempy wrote:
I don't see why the Sun's take KCP straight up. They already did the Lakers a favor with the Chandler deal, I get the feeling this will be the Lakers turn to scratch their back. They are going to give up a 2nd rounder at a minimum.

Interestingly the trade machines out there say this trade does nothing regarding projected wins for either team lol.

For anyone Wondering if it's possible to straight up trade KCP to Ariza. It is. The 50% trade rule is invoked in this situation.

I've heard 76ers being mentioned as 3rd team. One random guy that probably doesn't have any credibility. Had this trade:

Lakers get: Ariza

76ers get: KCP

Suns get: Flutz and pick

I feel like giving up flutz is a little much though so I dunno.

But exactly what you said Suns don't want KCP, that is why the rumor is Lakers finding a 3rd team that would get KCP and the 3rd team would provide Suns with a guard they are looking for.

Tempy
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Ray wrote:
I've heard 76ers being mentioned as 3rd team. One random guy that probably doesn't have any credibility. Had this trade:

Lakers get: Ariza

76ers get: KCP

Suns get: Flutz and pick

I feel like giving up flutz is a little much though so I dunno.

But exactly what you said Suns don't want KCP, that is why the rumor is Lakers finding a 3rd team that would get KCP and the 3rd team would provide Suns with a guard they are looking for.

From everything I've read the sun's have no interest in Fultz but it's almost time to see what happens

Angeluus
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Tempy wrote:
From everything I've read the sun's have no interest in Fultz but it's almost time to see what happens

I would not include a first rounder. Absolutely not. I would personally walk away if that's what they want.

Ray
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I just heard the Rockets could be interested in being a 3rd team and getting KCP.

MAGICLAKEZ
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Rockets and many other teams are eyeing KCP. On second thoughts let’s stick with KCP. Lol. He’s 25 (Ariza 33)and well within the age group of our core. He usually starts warming up during mid season as was evident last year. Call it mid season form. The initial reports seem to suggest that Ariza was the prized target but it’s turning out to be KCP.

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Ray
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:

Rockets and many other teams are eyeing KCP. On second thoughts let’s stick with KCP. Lol. He’s 25 (Ariza 33)and well within the age group of our core. He usually starts warming up during mid season as was evident last year. Call it mid season form. The initial reports seem to suggest that Ariza was the prized target but it’s turning out to be KCP.

99% chance KCP is not with us next year. He could stay, we have his bird rights. But that will affect our max spot for us this summer. If we need someone to only focus on guarding Durant or a wing player of similar skill in the playoffs, I would rather have Ariza then KCP.

MAGICLAKEZ
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Ray wrote:
99% chance KCP is not with us next year. He could stay, we have his bird rights. But that will affect our max spot for us this summer. If we need someone to only focus on guarding Durant or a wing player of similar skill in the playoffs, I would rather have Ariza then KCP.

I hear ya, but I also don’t want to resuscitate a potential west conf powerhouse in Houston. I’m looking at ways to clear the deck for us. Lol. I even root for eastern conf teams to beat West Conf teams. I know it’s a one in a million shot, but if we can somehow reach the west conf finals and upset GSW, who bets against us in the finals with Lebron? GSW is slightly shaky this year with the Green/Kd episode and not playing optimum ball. This is the perfect storm.

Tempy
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Ray wrote:
99% chance KCP is not with us next year. He could stay, we have his bird rights. But that will affect our max spot for us this summer. If we need someone to only focus on guarding Durant or a wing player of similar skill in the playoffs, I would rather have Ariza then KCP.

I'd go with Ariza, so long as he is taking a serious pay cut to stick around next season.

MAGICLAKEZ
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Ray
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
I hear ya, but I also don’t want to resuscitate a potential west powerhouse in Houston. I’m looking at ways to clear the deck for us. Lol. I even root for eastern teams to beat West teams. I know it’s a one in a million shot, but if we can somehow reach the west conference finals and upset GSW, who bets against us in the finals with Lebron? GSW is slightly shaky this year with the Green/Kd episode and not playing optimum ball. This is the perfect storm.

Before the season I said the Lakers will make conference finals unless they run into GSW before that round. I think they will beat any team in the West in the best of 7 except GSW. That's just what I think, I think you give LeBron a team that is not far superior like GSW and he will figure out what they need to do as a team to beat them.

MAGICLAKEZ
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Tempy
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:

Long term I would not be scared of KCP signing with the rockets. They have no way of getting better with out trading assets. CP3 is in decline and Harden has peaked. Their only chance of getting better is flipping Brandon Knight for something. Last year was their chance, I don't see them getting close to the team they were last year.

Ray
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Tempy wrote:
Long term I would not be scared of KCP signing with the rockets. They have no way of getting better with out trading assets. CP3 is in decline and Harden has peaked. Their only chance of getting better is flipping Brandon Knight for something. Last year was their chance, I don't see them getting close to the team they were last year.

The other thing is KCP bird rights do not go with him if he is traded. So HOU couldn't even resign him next year anyways with all their other salaries. I am with you, I am not worried about KCP turning around the Rockets, lol.

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Ray wrote:
The other thing is KCP bird rights do not go with him if he is traded. So HOU couldn't even resign him next year anyways with all their other salaries. I am with you, I am not worried about KCP turning around the Rockets, lol.

I was not talking about next year and beyond. I was alluding to the current climate. The rockets are a mess and I don’t want them to get any breathing room or help on the defensive end of the floor. They cannot get the KCP deal done without the lakers. It’s not a question of KCP turning things around. Ariza and Bahamoute were not game changers but they provided stability on the defensive end along with Tucker.

Tempy
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
I was not talking about next year and beyond. I was alluding to the current climate. The rockets are a mess and I don’t want them to get any breathing room or help on the defensive end of the floor. They cannot get the KCP deal done without the lakers. It’s not a question of KCP turning things around. Ariza and Bahamoute were not game changers but they provided stability on the defensive end along with Tucker.

Does this trade make the Lakers significantly better? KCP has been inconsistent but when he is on he is a great player but he is barely in the rotation right now. So I think it does. Does it make the Rockets significantly better? I think it does, the Rockets get a bigger upgrade from KCP than the Lakers do from Ariza.

I'm also going to assume this puts a dent in Kuz's and Ingram's minutes each night to get Ariza more minutes. So does that really help the Lakers long term?

Man this is a tough one. I'm not sure it's a good trade anymore.

MAGICLAKEZ
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Tempy wrote:
Does this trade make the Lakers significantly better? KCP has been inconsistent but when he is on he is a great player but he is barely in the rotation right now. So I think it does. Does it make the Rockets significantly better? I think it does, the Rockets get a bigger upgrade from KCP than the Lakers do from Ariza.

I'm also going to assume this puts a dent in Kuz's and Ingram's minutes each night to get Ariza more minutes. So does that really help the Lakers long term?

Man this is a tough one. I'm not sure it's a good trade anymore.

This is exactly what I was thinking as well. They will give the veteran more mins and deprive the youngsters of vital development mins. Hart will also suffer. You are right it’s not such a great trade even though the optics might suggest otherwise.

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userpete1037
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:

Very good to hear.

userpete1037
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:

The Godfather....lol.

MAGICLAKEZ
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userpete1037 wrote:
Very good to hear.

What I’m really surprised about is why isn’t Houston trying to get Ariza? They are only eyeing KCP. Ariza is eligible to be traded to any team including Houston

Angeluus
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Was Phoenix asking for Ball/Ingram for Ariza? They can go **** themselves.

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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
I was not talking about next year and beyond. I was alluding to the current climate. The rockets are a mess and I don’t want them to get any breathing room or help on the defensive end of the floor. They cannot get the KCP deal done without the lakers. It’s not a question of KCP turning things around. Ariza and Bahamoute were not game changers but they provided stability on the defensive end along with Tucker.

Agreed.

Ray
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
What I’m really surprised about is why isn’t Houston trying to get Ariza? They are only eyeing KCP. Ariza is eligible to be traded to any team including Houston

I assume there is bad blood there after not getting another contract from Hou and Ariza doesn't want to play in HOU at this point.

userpete1037
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LNS HOF Platinum
Posts: 20294
Location: Kobe, Kalifornia
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
What I’m really surprised about is why isn’t Houston trying to get Ariza? They are only eyeing KCP. Ariza is eligible to be traded to any team including Houston

Maybe PHX is asking for too much for him at his age.

MAGICLAKEZ
votes: 70
LNS HOF Gold
Posts: 16783
Location: Los Angeles, California
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userpete1037 wrote:
Maybe PHX is asking for too much for him at his age.

I’m always skeptical about doing biz with them after the Nash nightmare. Lol. They have this bad habit of attacking our FO...after making them bend forward. LmFao!!!

MAGICLAKEZ
votes: 70
LNS HOF Gold
Posts: 16783
Location: Los Angeles, California
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userpete1037
votes: 18
LNS HOF Platinum

Posts: 20294
Location: Kobe, Kalifornia
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
I’m always skeptical about doing biz with them after the Nash nightmare. Lol. They have this bad habit of attacking our FO...after making them bend forward. LmFao!!!

You ain't lying bro. That Nash deal to me was the worst deal in NBA history. He was already washed up laying on the floor getting back stretched all the time....smh. Man let me stop. Bringing back memories...lol.

userpete1037
votes: 18
LNS HOF Platinum
Posts: 20294
Location: Kobe, Kalifornia
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:

Go hell Stan with your no coaching azz!!!!!

suntzu619
votes: 6
Laker GM
Posts: 2599

Woj just tweeted Ariza going to the Washington Wizards. Looks like KCP is staying for a bit longer.

userpete1037
votes: 18
LNS HOF Platinum
Posts: 20294
Location: Kobe, Kalifornia
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suntzu619 wrote:
Woj just tweeted Ariza going to the Washington Wizards. Looks like KCP is staying for a bit longer.

Dam so he's going from one bad team to another....lol.

suntzu619
votes: 6
Laker GM
Posts: 2599

userpete1037 wrote:
Dam so he's going from one bad team to another....lol.

That Is exactly what I said. But in his defense he went to a better bad team. Woj justed tweeted the other players involved. Phoenix is getting Austin Rivers and role players, Memphis is getting Kelley Oubre and of course Ariza to Washington. Phoenix just got worst if that is even possible lol!!!!


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