Web Etiquette 101: Do not post full articles

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BigD
votes: 9
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Age: 47
Posts: 1667
Location: Bay Area
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Every day I see folks post complete news articles from other sights.

This is very bad web etiquette (not to mention copyright infringement in most cases) to post a full article. The businesses that post the original articles will want to maximize page hits.

The more accepted approach is to post a teaser (a few paragraphs), but leave the majority of the post to be read on the website on which it is hosted.

Plus this is a discussion forum, not a news posting repository, so it's also desirable to see some commentary on the article or a brief summary.

This requirement should discourage people form continually posting articles in bursts and focus on the ones that are really interesting.

I just posted an example: Fun read: Notes from the MVP Ceremony

cuckooroller
votes: 114
LNS HOF Silver
Posts: 12411
Location: Italy

Yes, I agree. Posting a link should be sufficient.

L4K
votes: 61
LNS HOF Bronze

Posts: 8306
Location: Sydney, Australia
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I think it is better to post the entire article. No offence to you, BigD, but my internet sometime can be very slow and this is one of the sites that loads up quickly. If I had to get onto one of those sites at times then it would be very annoying for me. I don't know how everyone else feels about this but this is my opinion.

BUT, I can understand where you are coming from but it has been like this for such a long time and I don't think the vets (J-Cool especially) have ever been told not to post an entire article but I could be dead wrong.

Also, this is in the wrong forum considering it's not about the Lakers. I'll move it to the everything else section.

L4K
votes: 61
LNS HOF Bronze

Posts: 8306
Location: Sydney, Australia
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I've moved this to the announcement section but I don't know if Dave is going to enforce this or not so just wait and see.

I'm not sure if it's even an announcement so if one of the other mods could help me out here it would be appreciated.

gemfow
votes: 181
LNS HOF Silver

Posts: 12402
Location: Maryland
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I know you mean well BigD, but you just joined in March bro. Maybe if you joined in January or something then you could flaunt some tenureship.........lol.

It doesn't matter to me whether the whole article is posted or not personally, but some people may like the fact that people do post the whole article.

Biggest thing is what happens with J-Cool after this, does he lose his job security?

Mamba247
votes: 49
Laker GM

Posts: 3032

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Lakers4Kobe wrote:
I think it is better to post the entire article. No offence to you, BigD, but my internet sometime can be very slow and this is one of the sites that loads up quickly. If I had to get onto one of those sites at times then it would be very annoying for me. I don't know how everyone else feels about this but this is my opinion.

BUT, I can understand where you are coming from but it has been like this for such a long time and I don't think the vets (J-Cool especially) have ever been told not to post an entire article but I could be dead wrong.

Also, this is in the wrong forum considering it's not about the Lakers. I'll move it to the everything else section.

I agree with what you said. It´s just more comfortable that you can read the whole article just by clicking on the topic.

nikodaza
votes: 6
Big-Time Laker Fan
Posts: 966

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You put the link anyways..

jbully314
votes: 8
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1427

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Either way is fine with me. It's at the discretion of the person posting it. However they want it to be read, they're the one that found it, so I will trust that person's judgment.

lakerbloke
votes: 26
Laker GM

Posts: 3315

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Yeah, I'm not bothered either way it's posted as long as it's posted in the right section.

Dave
votes: 45
Site Admin
Posts: 5378

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BigD has a good point- a teaser portion of the article is more appropriate because it gives the source more respect and credit. I do see how it's more convenient for a lot of us who rather read the entire article here on LTB.

I'm not going to ban anyone over if you post the whole article. But I do want to recommend not posting the whole story and always including a link to the source (which you guys always do anyways). It's the right thing to do. Thanks everyone!

clouducla
votes: 1
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1603

some websites require a membership to look at their articles, i know espn does w/ its insider articles. So i think posting the entire article (w// the link) to these type of websites is cool, but for the ones that everybody can access this may apply.

OC_Showtime
votes: 22
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1634
Location: Irvine,CA

The problem is that a lot of sites are limited to subcribers only so the links don't work unless you sign up. I can't imagine there is any copyright infringement unless the poster is claiming the article as their own. I do agree the source should be listed as they deserve acknowledgement. Also, at my work, they monitor web activity and block sites they consider "social group" type sites so often the links are blocked for that reason. I hope posters will continue to post the entire article and recaps of video and audio interviews as it is greatly appreciated.

LA_85
votes: 3
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1005
Location: Inglewood
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It really shouldnt matter... its the internet.

post the whole article, post a link. dont matter.

so what if we take away a few hits from the OC register, its an internet article.

their focus is selling papers.

BigD
votes: 9
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Age: 47
Posts: 1667
Location: Bay Area
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To All:

1) I'm not trying to be the internet police; I'm merely pointing out that posting an entire article is stealing content, just as when an entire video is posted on Youtube, it gets the likes of Disney, etc. upset because it is copyright infringement.

There is no difference between video and print. It is copyright infringement regardless, and if someone wanted to crack down, they could. If you write a blog on this site and someone else posts the entire thing somewhere else, it is copyright infringement. The ONLY content you may freely post is that from "wiki" sites or any site like that that explicitly gives permission to copy.

How do I know all this? I write for a magazine that also posts all written articles on their website and I run a few websites of my own and I have taken a copyritght class.

2) The point of posting printed articles on line is to get hits that generate revenue form the various forms of ads that appear above and within the articles. That's why articles are spread across multiple pages so they can serve up more ads. There is no technical reason to do so. Someone's job may depend on revenue from clicks. No Joke.

3) The places that require memberships do so for a reason. I am not fond of this approach, but it is their choice and we have to live with that.

4) Personally, I'd like to see a little analysis or summary of the article at the top so I know if it is something I want to read or not. This is a discussion forum after all and not a news repository.

At the end of the day though, Dave said he is not going to ban anyone, and personally I am not going to say anything beyond this post. As I mentioned, I am not trying to be the internet police.

Peace,

BigD

clouducla
votes: 1
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1603

agreed....

J-Cool
votes: 34
Laker GM
Posts: 4297

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Big D I Sorry man but peoples like poppingtags would ask me to post to whole article man. Dave please don't be upset with me.

BigD
votes: 9
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1667
Location: Bay Area
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J-Cool wrote:
Big D I Sorry man but peoples like poppingtags would ask me to post to whole article man. Dave please don't be upset with me.

J-Cool, no need to be sorry. You provide a great service by digging up great tidbits off the web.

I'm just trying to make people aware that magazines and newspapers are going through rough times right now and every click through counts.

And personally I'd love to see your insight into each article above the text.

What made you stop and think "Hmmm the fellas at LTB would like/dislike this article?" This can help kick-starts the discussion too.

And one extra click ain't gonna send anyone to the emergency room. Very Happy

kundipile
votes: 2
Big-Time Laker Fan
Posts: 875

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I never really thought of this before, but I fully agree with BigD. Regardless of how fast your internet is, it doesn't condone taking away web traffic from host sites. And I'm not fully aware of this, but I would assume that one way management evaluates an online writer's performance would be the amount of web hits his/her articles draw.

LKnight
votes: 70
Laker GM
Posts: 4173

J-Cool wrote:
Big D I Sorry man but peoples like poppingtags would ask me to post to whole article man. Dave please don't be upset with me.

I personally don't see how posting a portion would benefit everyone when the other site requires you to sign up in order to read the full article. ex (Latimes).

Now half the people here wont want to waste time going through a whole registering process just to see the latest Laker news. I know I wont...and I'm registered with alot of them.

But that's just me.

l

BigD
votes: 9
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1667
Location: Bay Area
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Repped High Quality Post

LKnight wrote:

I personally don't see how posting a portion would benefit everyone when the other site requires you to sign up in order to read the full article. ex (Latimes).

Now half the people here wont want to waste time going through a whole registering process just to see the latest Laker news. I know I wont...and I'm registered with alot of them.

But that's just me.

l

I feel the same way and I hate registering for a site, but I believe this hurts sites like the Times rather than helping them. People should write to the Times telling them how lame it is. Maybe we could form a petition here...

Regardless, it does not change the copyright laws and other points made above.

By the way, for those of you that use Firefox, there is a plugin that allows you to post a "disposable email" address that links to your real address. It is active long enough to register for sites like the Times.

Here is the link to the tool: TrashMail.net 1.0.10

LakerFanGolfer
votes: 8
Laker GM
Posts: 3075
Location: Philippines
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I have never thought of this before and I agree. Web based articles needs hits to generate revenue from sponsors. Thank you BigD for the input. REPPED!

BigD
votes: 9
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1667
Location: Bay Area
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LakerFanGolfer wrote:
I have never thought of this before and I agree. Web based articles needs hits to generate revenue from sponsors. Thank you BigD for the input. REPPED!

Thanks for the vote LakerFanGolfer!

FWIW, I found an interesting site that breaks down copyright laws in the digital age. If some company wanted to go after (sue) LTB, it would not take much: Copyright Law

The most important thing to take away from the website: as with virtually any other law, negligence is not an excuse to break it.

Now let's get back to some good discussions! 8)

Rjones13LAL
votes: 4
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1418
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL

i can see where your coming from, but I dont feel like it really matters enough to cahnge the way we do things now.

sites like espn and yahoo have enough money, theyll be fine

81-KOBE-81
votes: 0
Serious Laker Fan
Posts: 478

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I much prefer having the whole article.

Omarkb24
votes: 12
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 2111

us.gif

haha..Web etiqutte?

are u serious????

WHats next, porn etiquette?

Its all Okay if it has a link underneath it

optimistic7292
votes: 57
LNS HOF Bronze
Posts: 8020
Location: LA

Omarkb24 wrote:
haha..Web etiqutte?

are u serious????

WHats next, porn etiquette?

Its all Okay if it has a link underneath it

Question

He was just giving suggestions.

LakersFranchise
votes: 12
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1792
Location: Los Angels

I Never read the long Los Angeles Times articles or any long articles that people post up so it doesnt affect me at all

trublulaker
votes: 5
Big-Time Laker Fan
Posts: 577

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Quote:
I much prefer having the whole article.

I too prefer the whole article posted...

BigD
votes: 9
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1667
Location: Bay Area
us.gif

You all need to actually read the posts. I was being polite at first, but in reality it is copyright infringement. It is NOT okay just because you post a link under it. It is no different than posting a photo or Disney video.

This site can get shut down and the owner sued if someone wanted to do so.

Please go back and read my posts. Dave also chimed in and said he supports this decision.

As I also said in a prior post, I am not looking to police the site or anything like that. I am in a unique position to impart my knowledge of the subject here.

Do as you will; post the whole article or not, but I am relaying the potential consequences. Don't shoot the messenger. Shocked

trublulaker
votes: 5
Big-Time Laker Fan
Posts: 577

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Quote:

You all need to actually read the posts. I was being polite at first, but in reality it is copyright infringement. It is NOT okay just because you post a link under it. It is no different than posting a photo or Disney video.

This site can get shut down and the owner sued if someone wanted to do so.

Please go back and read my posts. Dave also chimed in and said he supports this decision.

As I also said in a prior post, I am not looking to police the site or anything like that. I am in a unique position to impart my knowledge of the subject here.

Do as you will; post the whole article or not, but I am relaying the potential consequences.

I get your point BigD but i'm sure the owners of the articles being posted here will understand that this site is a non profit site and only purely a fan based site. But if this site will be put into a bad position because of copyright infringement, then i am in support of your stance. Its up to the MODS and Site administrator, they are in a better position to decide on this. By the way, i am a law student here in the Philippines and at the same time working in the Judiciary department so i guess i'll have to be law abiding even in LTB.

BigD
votes: 9
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1667
Location: Bay Area
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trublulaker wrote:

I get your point BigD but i'm sure the owners of the articles being posted here will understand that this site is a non profit site and only purely a fan based site. But if this site will be put into a bad position because of copyright infringement, then i am in support of your stance. Its up to the MODS and Site administrator, they are in a better position to decide on this. By the way, i am a law student here in the Philippines and at the same time working in the Judiciary department so i guess i'll have to be law abiding even in LTB.

I totally see where you are coming from, but keep in mind that all news websites rely heavily on web traffic. I write for a living and own several websites, so I told Dave about this potential issue and he urged me to post.

The point is I don't think he, the moderators, or many people that use this forum are aware of the potential consequences from pasting an article. All it would take is one power-hungry lawyer with a chip on his shoulder to close this site down. The music and video industry has made examples of individuals and corporations and so why not text/photos next?

It never hurts to err on the side of caution.

BTW: I have been to Cebu and I absolutely LOVED IT. Anyone that has a chance to go to the Philippines should check out Cebu.

trublulaker
votes: 5
Big-Time Laker Fan
Posts: 577

rp.gif

Quote:

I get your point BigD but i'm sure the owners of the articles being posted here will understand that this site is a non profit site and only purely a fan based site. But if this site will be put into a bad position because of copyright infringement, then i am in support of your stance. Its up to the MODS and Site administrator, they are in a better position to decide on this. By the way, i am a law student here in the Philippines and at the same time working in the Judiciary department so i guess i'll have to be law abiding even in LTB.

I totally see where you are coming from, but keep in mind that all news websites rely heavily on web traffic. I write for a living and own several websites, so I told Dave about this potential issue and he urged me to post.

The point is I don't think he, the moderators, or many people that use this forum are aware of the potential consequences from pasting an article. All it would take is one power-hungry lawyer with a chip on his shoulder to close this site down. The music and video industry has made examples of individuals and corporations and so why not text/photos next?

It never hurts to err on the side of caution.

BTW: I have been to Cebu and I absolutely LOVED IT. Anyone that has a chance to go to the Philippines should check out Cebu.

I guess its Dave's and the Mods' decision now. Its their call whether to restrict, prohibit or allow the posting of news articles in toto. Personally, i'd prefer to post the article verbatim but i'll be exercising self-restraint from hereon in in support of your position.

bs_offtopic

I'm glad you've come to loved Cebu coz i've never been there myself. Hope you check out other tourist spots here like Boracay, Palawan, Puerto Galera and many more especially this time of the year coz it is summer here.

LA_85
votes: 3
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1005
Location: Inglewood
po.gif

isnt it a rule to post the link with any article?

lets leave it at that.

im on here to read articles... if i want links to articles, i'll google them.

clutchkb24
votes: 11
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Posts: 1177

us.gif

BIGD- Thanks for all the good information. I have a question for you though. I don't know how long this site has been running for but don't you think Dave would have gotten some type of warning already?

BigD
votes: 9
Die-Hard Laker Fan
Age: 47
Posts: 1667
Location: Bay Area
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clutchkb24 wrote:
BIGD- Thanks for all the good information. I have a question for you though. I don't know how long this site has been running for but don't you think Dave would have gotten some type of warning already?

Clutch, I am happy to provide such information, although I did not mean to cause such havoc here.

I can not speak for what Dave knew or did not know or whether he received warning in the past; Perhaps he knew it was wrong on some level but did not realize the potential consequences. I can only tell you that he agreed the teaser method was the way to go and asked me to post this topic.

In some states, you can get a DUI with a BAL of .04, but it's not like this information is posted on the state's welcome sign. If you do not realize this ahead of time and drink like you are in Cali, you could wind up in jail and with a lot of problems on your hand. Negligence of the law holds no water in court.

I just happened to notice a trend and brought it to Dave's attention. I thought if he agreed, he would be the one posting, but he asked me to, so I did.

I doubt any news paper would ever do anything more than demand people stop copying their articles, but with some people's livelihoods on the line and with the fight to save printed material, you never know so why chance it?

Again, in the end, I hope everyone realizes that it was never my intent to take anything away from anyone on this site. It was only to keep people aware of the issues.

gemfow
votes: 181
LNS HOF Silver

Posts: 12402
Location: Maryland
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BigD - I know you just said you doubt that a newspaper will do anything more than demand people to stop copying their articles. I seriously doubt that it would even go that far.

Do you have a link to proper web etiquette? I tried looking it up and couldn't find anything stating this. Or is this something like flashing your hi-beams to a trucker to let him know it's okay for him to cross lanes? Better yet more like riding in the fast lane and allowing someone to pass by you switching lanes? Something appreciated but not necessarily enforced.

frank
votes: 4
Big-Time Laker Fan
Posts: 933
Location: Long Beach, CA

A new article that is very recent and fresh should not be quoted in full simply because the publisher and writer deserve the credit and site hits for their work -- (your are citing them because it's a good one, aren't you?) In a recently published article I prefer to always note the publisher & writer's name, the url, and a few excerpts from the article that get the point I want to make across, but the reader has to go to the original url to get the full read, and the writer & publisher get hits, and this is good for them. I usually do the same for an older one, but I would more likely quote larger portions and just post the url. What each of you do is up to you, but that's my take.

noname24
votes: 35
LNS HOF Bronze
Posts: 8855

I don't read the article unless it's short. Posters should just take the main parts of the article and post it on the front page.


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